Break Toxic Relationship Cycles | with Kel Cal

Michael: Kel Cal is a mindset life transformation and empowerment coach for women as well as a speaker, author, and host of the Dear dumb bitch podcast. We've already lost half the audience, welcome Cal.

Kel: Ah, thank you. Thank you, Michael. I'm so excited to be here with you.

Michael: Yeah, I'm excited to have you. You know, it's funny as I was thinking about this in the prep to interviewing you and having this conversation is, there are there's something valid about being a little bit polarizing when you're trying to get people's attention So they  change, you know, you see this in the  context of language in, whether it be NLP or how I do in coaching or maybe how you do as well. And I'm just wondering, let's just start this off because I want to create context because I know introducing you as the host of the dear dumb bitch podcast, people are like, I'm not a bitch. I'm not dumb, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. Which respect, we all identify differently. So I'm curious, where did that come from and what does that mean in your life?

Kel: It's interesting because I have the exact voice notes where I was just talking out loud and brainstorming coming up for the name for my podcast. I had the vision to start a podcast and I'm like, what the fuck am I going to call this thing? And I'm like, dear dumb bitch, that's it. And the context for dear dumb bitches, kind of Dear Diary, but Dear Dumb Bitch, because we all have an inner dumb bitch who's teaching us life lessons when we actually pay attention, and when I say dumb bitch, I mean that in the most endearing and loving way. It's about really just like embracing this human ego part of ourself and allowing that to be one of our greatest teachers, because so often we shame that part of ourselves. And this is actually about empowering that aspect of herself to become the version of ourselves that we're meant to be by learning those lessons that our inner dumb bitch is teaching us every single day. And I ignored mine for most of my life and she didn't go away. She just kept getting louder and louder. And so I'm like, Oh, okay, cool. Maybe I should embrace this part of myself, so that's dear dumb bitch.

Michael: It's interesting about that. When I hit my rock bottom moment and I went and pulled myself out of it, it was literally me standing in front of a mirror, and for lack of a better way to phrase it, I was just  destroying myself because I had to, because I put. So much emphasis on hiding from reality. I just pretended life was great and life's not great. If you're 350 pounds smoking two packs a day, cheating on your girlfriend with 20 other chicks in debt, getting your car repoed, like life's not great. So I don't know why we're lying to ourselves. How much of that is really about honesty?

Kel: Oh, honesty is everything because I, like you, have had multiple rock bottoms. I thought I was at rock bottom and every time I was at rock bottom kept getting deeper and deeper because I was lying to myself and because I was really abandoning myself and I wasn't allowing myself to see the role that I was playing in my life, I was still playing into that victim mentality of it was this or it was that or if that changes and it wasn't until I really allowed myself to get honest and be like, Oh, wait, I'm the common denominator in my life here. If I want my life to change, then I need to really change and I need to make these changes from a place of love and acceptance, and compassion towards myself because shaming yourself into change does not work. It's just reinforcing those underlying programs and patterns. And for the longest time I was trying to hate my way to my best self and it wasn't working.

Michael: I think that, this is my personal experience, I don't shame people as a coach, obviously that's not my role, but I definitely shamed myself and I did it because it had to be done and I actually wrote about this just a couple of weeks ago and I was talking about there is a power in being embarrassed about your decision. Because it makes you reflect on them and question what am I doing? If you really are continually destroying your life, maybe you need a little bit of shame, I'm not saying destroy yourself like I did. And look, that's different, everybody needs a different thing, I come from chaos. So to just sit here and cuddle myself and be nice I had already done that. It wasn't getting the job done. But in these moments where I was like, no motherfucker, get your shit together, you should be embarrassed, you're wearing a size, 47 pants, 4XL shirt, you're about to have to get the extender to get on the airplane. What are you doing? And I realized that because I grew up playing sports and I'm a man, and maybe it's a little bit different cause you're not, I didn't need as much of that kind candor. I needed somebody really to kick me in the ass. I'm wondering because. There is such an emphasis on this idea of leading yourself with love, can that be a detriment? Can you like overly love yourself to the point where you're actually stuck?

Kel: Yeah, and it's, for me, I feel like it really is this balance of being honest with yourself and not sugarcoating shit, and sometimes you need to just have that real honest heart to heart with yourself. What the fuck? What's happening here? Look at the reality that you have created. And also having that place of love where it's okay, cool, I created this, I can love the parts of myself that created this and I can love myself enough to make the changes that are necessary to create the reality that I desire to create the reality that I deserve. And for me within my coaching as well, like I'm not going to sugar coat shit. That doesn't serve my clients and when we sugarcoat shit to ourselves, that doesn't serve us either, sugar just gives you cavities, it makes you fat. It's not actually creating the life that you desire. So it is in being brutally honest with yourself from that place of love. I really feel like it's about the underlying intention and energy and sometimes having those really honest conversations with yourself, it is the most difficult thing to do, but it's also the most loving thing to do.

Michael: Yeah. I want to go deep into this, you, I wrote this note just now. Sugar gives you cavities, I love that. I'm probably just going to steal it from you. What was childhood like for you? I look at and I take consideration of all of our experiences are the top are today are the sum total of everything we've ever been through, whether we like it or not, nature versus nurture. Our experiences shape us into who we are, even our traumatic rock bottoms moments. And so you, what was growing up like? What was childhood for you?

Kel: Yeah, it's interesting because I had no awareness of childhood trauma, the inner child relationship, any of that, until I began my own personal journey of self love and self discovery, a.k.a the healing journey, after leaving an emotionally abusive and toxic as fuck marriage and just restarting my life in every possible way. That right there was one of my many rock bottoms. And my childhood was I would say probably a pretty stereotypical child for a white female growing up in the U.S. So I lived with a middle class family, my parents were married, my, they both worked, and I was an overachiever, and I learned from an early age that when I achieve, when I do things, when I play into that good girl role, I am acknowledged, I feel important, I feel seen, I feel connection. And also, looking at the dynamics between my parents, which I did not know until I actually dove into my own healing journey from childhood trauma, but looking at their own dynamics and looking at how I always felt responsible for their emotions. So I lived my life and I lived my childhood feeling responsible for their happiness, feeling responsible for them to love themselves, and then, of course, we make the narratives of, Oh, I'm not making them love themselves, I'm not making them happy because it's impossible to make somebody else love. or to create happiness for them. And then it was really unwinding all of those narratives where I could see, Oh, all of this has been recreated in every relationship I've ever had. It's been reflected in my sense of self worth or really lack thereof. And every experience I've ever had in childhood has been recreated in my current reality and I joke and I say that 99 percent of the problems we have in life are because of childhood and it's not really a joke, it's because that's where we are conditioned. That's where we learn. Our early caregivers are our role models and it's an understanding that we get to actually make the changes so we don't have to keep recreating our past.

Michael: Yeah, were there moments that you recall where in that overachiever space that you didn't get the love, that you didn't get the acknowledgement that you were seeking? Because when I think back in my childhood, there were, there was almost nothing I could do to get love or admiration in my home. And that is In part, my mom was a drug addict and alcoholic. My stepdad was an alcoholic and super abusive. My grandmother was this weird old racist white lady and I'm biracial. So it's the cards were stacked against me. And I remember one time, I think I've only shared this on the podcast one time. I was on the wrestling team for most of my childhood, I just love combat sports, it's always been a part of my life and I had won this pretty big tournament. This is so ridiculous, I won this pretty big tournament and I got a first place, I had this gold medal, and there was this girl I had a  giant crush on, like she is the most gorgeous girl in our whole high school. And I walk up to her in the lunchroom and I just go, look, I won this medal. And she was like, what are you talking about, man? And so there was always this need growing up for me to seek that acknowledgement, I was not an overachiever, but I did some really cool shit. And it always seemed to be invisible. Were there moments where you like Were cognizant of this as a kid where you're like, if I do this, I get that was there specific things that happened?

Kel: Yeah, I would say it was actually more of the opposite scenario. So if I didn't get a good grade, if I didn't get straight A's, it wasn't like my parents were like, what the fuck is wrong with you? But that was just always the unspoken expectation. And especially as a teenager, where teenagers have this rebellious phase, at least I did, and whenever I did something that went against what my parents believed I should be doing or what my parents standards were, seeing the repercussions of that and feeling the effects when I made a perceived mistake, that was more reinforcing for these patterns of perfectionism, these patterns of people pleasing than the opposite.

Michael: Yeah, that's a hard, like navigating that world is almost impossible because it's a lose situation, right? Because on this one hand, you'll do anything it takes to be able to get that love. And then on the other hand, it's like that love is only reinforced by you doing anything that it takes. And it's like being in this weird spiral. And that's how you see all the time people. In these massively codependent relationships where maybe they're overachievers or they try to change their partner, which is like insane, right? And you see these things happen and happen again, and it leads you down this path where, in my life, I would do anything that it took to get love from anybody who was willing to give it to me. And that meant a whole series of just. Some of the worst decisions a human could make, especially when it comes to intimacy and love and connection, and it was almost like the thriving and the chaos was the thing that made me feel loved and valued, you talked about stepping into like really this aftermath of beginning a healing journey through this relationship, this marriage that you had what was that like pain as a picture? ‘Cause I, and the reason I'm asking you this question is because I know there are people who are listening right now who. They might be in a really bad relationship and they need to get out. They need to make a decision to walk away. Maybe this is the one thing that they're holding on to. So what was happening in that relationship and what ultimately became the pivot for you?

Kel: So I thought I was living my dream life. My dream looked, my life looked amazing from the outside. I lived in this beautiful home that I remodeled to perfection, it was paid off, I lived in sunny South Florida, I drove a Porsche, I had six pack abs, I had a successful business, my husband at the time was my business partner and my life looked really good and I was miserable, miserable. I knew the marriage was not healthy, I did not realize how toxic and abusive it was at the time, mostly because I was still so blind to my own patterns and conditioning and also with the gaslighting and the manipulation and the abuse. I was conditioned to doubt myself and I doubted myself before. I was very disconnected from myself and I just knew I could not keep living that life. So on December 16th, 2017, that is the day my intuition took over. I had no plans of telling the then abusive, now ex husband that I wanted a divorce, but that was the day that I began to unwind everything. Now, I did not commit to leaving at that point in time, and things didn't get better. Shocking, I'm sure. Everything I had experienced over the years, the abuse, the control, the isolation, the manipulation, it just amplified until I literally felt like I was drowning, and I had to escape my life immediately. So I got permission to take what was supposed to be a two week trip to Washington, and Just a side note, if you feel like you need permission to live your life, if you feel like you need permission to make a decision, then that's a major red flag right there, you're not living your life, you're living somebody else's life. But that's, that was where I was at. So I got permission to take this trip. And from the second I got to the airport, I knew there was no way I could ever go back and it was on that two week trip that I made the decision I knew in my heart and soul I needed to make, which was not only to leave the marriage, but to move across the country and restart my life. So after the two weeks, I flew back to Florida, I was locked out of my dream house, I had to go, get it go in and pack up my shit in garbage bags. I then filed for divorce, I went broke overnight after the my ex husband now withdrew every penny from our joint account, so then I returned my Porsche, and two days later I was on a flight back to Washington, and I'm like, alright, I guess I live here now let's fucking do this. I had a suitcase and a dream of a different vision for myself, and I was determined that was not going to be the worst thing that ever happened to me, and that somehow it would be the catalyst to become the second chance in life and the greatest thing that ever happened to me. And I can now say with 100 percent certainty, it absolutely was. But at that point in time, I was not prepared for the aftermath. I literally thought it would be as simple as moving across the country to restart my life in every possible way and being broken, technically homeless and living with my sister who also lived in Washington. I was not prepared, I did not understand the trauma that I had experienced in the relationship, and subsequently I was not aware of the trauma I had experienced that led me to that relationship in the first place. So that was where the journey really began.

Michael: Yeah, and so much of that is connecting the dots, right? I go look back at some of the relationships I had and luckily I never really, never was in a physically abusive relationship, though. I did have an ex smack the shit out of me. One time I did deserve that, I would have smacked me too. All thoughts considered, but they were always like emotionally abusive. We would say the fucking meanest things. I could not imagine saying some of the things that we said to each other, to any human being today. Right now that involves a lot of healing and a lot of this journey. I want to talk about this. Cause I think it's really important, there are words that are buzzwords right now. They get thrown away, thrown around all the time, toxic, narcissistic, abusive, and people will often throw these words around just because they are a disagreement or maybe because they don't see the same way that another person does. And it's getting a little bit dangerous, right? I'm curious whatever you're comfortable with. And we don't have to go in this, but I think it's really important, especially for the people listening. What did the, like, when you think about toxic, abusive, manipulative, those words that you use, what does that look like in that kind of relationship? Maybe not even necessarily yours particularly, but I think it'll be a benefit to describe what these can look like in a relationship.

Kel: Yeah. So we know the red flags we had lots of conversations about red flags, that's not a new concept, but when you ignore the red flags and these relationships unfold, that's when there really is this distortion in the dynamics of power and control within the relationship. And that really is what makes our relationship not healthy, when you have this distortion of power. And not all toxic relationships are abusive but all abusive relationships are toxic and it is very much a spectrum. So a toxic relationship could be that you are choosing to stay in a relationship that is not aligned with your values. You're choosing to stay in a relationship that is not aligned with the vision that you have for your life. You're choosing to stay in a relationship where you're hoping your partner will change. It doesn't mean that the person is this evil, horrific person. It doesn't mean that there is abuse, but it just means that it's not a healthy relationship. Now, looking at toxic relationships as being the spectrum, yes, a lot of times there will be gaslighting where you are conditioned to doubt your own reality and you literally feel like a crazy person, like I literally thought I was going insane. I wasn't sure if I was making the best decision of my life when I was leaving or the worst decision of my life when I was leaving and the manipulation and the control. But ultimately, I gave away my personal power, I didn't even realize I had any power in the relationship and I thought I was responsible for the emotions of another person and I thought that if I could love them enough, they would love themselves. So I was living my life basically just serving my personal power up on a silver platter to someone who desperately wanted that. So it became this perfect storm and there's so much talk now about like narcissists and narcissistic relationships and narcissistic abuse and there's this epidemic of narcissists and first of all, we do not decide if somebody is a narcissist, that's an actual like clinical diagnosis. It is a very under diagnosed condition because most of the time someone who does have a narcissistic personality disorder is not going to the psychiatrist to get that diagnosis because we don't know what the diagnosis is, part of the factors of narcissism is it's everybody else's fault, but that being said, I don't believe that we have this society of narcissists. I feel like we have a society of people with unhealed trauma. And yes, it presents as that but hurt people and I was hurt in the relationship also, I played a role as well. It takes two to fucking tango. And it wasn't until I allowed myself to get really honest and recognize the role that I played in the relationship, the patterns of codependency I had, and everything that I was bringing, that I was truly able to heal, because for the longest time, I was a victim. It was poor me, I was abused, I was experiencing emotional abuse, I was manipulated, I was controlled, I walked on eggshells, there was all of these unspoken rules in the relationship, and it wasn't until I realized the role that I played that true healing occurred, and we make ourselves victims and we continue to play into that victim consciousness when it's this happened to me. And really the partner I had was the perfect partner. He was mirroring my own beliefs, he was mirroring my subconscious patterns, he was the greatest teacher I ever had. And I have so much appreciation for this now because those were the lessons I needed to learn and when we have this experience of being in a toxic relationship or an abusive relationship, when we have the awareness of it, it really is this calling and this invitation from our soul that it's time to evolve. It's time to see the patterns. It's time to see our own role in the circumstances of our life. And I also truly believe that it's part of our soul's contract. Like our soul creates contracts and the experience of being at a toxic relationship, like your soul chose that because it's providing you the opportunity to learn the lessons that you need for your own evolution. And we as humans like to resist those lessons, but those are the lessons that allow us to evolve, to step into that next level of ourself, to strip away the patterns and programming and all that we're not so that we can become more of all that we are.

Michael: I love that you, I've taken responsibility for your decisions. And what do I mean by that? Whenever I'm speaking with someone and they are willing to accept the role that they play, I know with certainty they've done the work because at first you're like, nope, this is their fault. This is all on them, there's no way that I could ever have been wrong. And then it's actually, okay. It's not necessarily about right or wrong, it's about what role did you play? And I love that you said that partnership was mirroring and they've really are like you, you heal. What's so interesting about the dynamics of relationships when you have this need to be seen by another human being, it's really a need to see yourself and that mirroring what that does is it presents with you for you an opportunity to really show up and do the work. And even though it's an incredibly, unbelievably uncomfortable, the only reason that I know with certainty I'm here today and that I live the life that I live, that I date the people I date, that I have the relationships with friends and business and in my communities that I have is because of these moments of deep reflection of being across from someone, whether interpersonally or intimately, and just being like, man, there's something that drives me crazy about this person. What is my role in that? Man, there's something about this person that just they get under my skin, why? And one of the biggest lessons I've learned in the last. 14 years of my healing journey, almost 14 years, which is incredible is to think about my thoughts and to just take a step back and be like, why does this person do this to me? And if you're not willing to do that, like you can't be helped. And I know that's so hard for people to hear. And I've interviewed incredible human beings, both male and female who have been on this show, who have left abusive relationships. And they always acknowledge their responsibility. What did it really take to you? What did it really take for you to get to that place where you could acknowledge your role in this?

Kel: Yeah. It actually was another rock bottom in the form of COVID where my greatest fear came true. And that was I was forced to be alone with myself.

Michael: Terrifying…

Kel: The time, that was terrifying, especially when all of the distractions that I was using to avoid and escape myself because I was still carrying a tremendous amount of trauma were removed. And I really realized oh, fuck, and it was then that I recognized that the most toxic relationship of all was not the relationship with the then abusive now ex husband, it was the relationship with myself and it was in recognizing that the relationship with myself is not only the most important relationship that there is, But that every relationship in your life is just a mirror of that, that I really allowed myself to recognize the patterns that I was still living. It allowed me to recognize all the coping mechanisms I had developed to avoid the trauma that I was still holding onto. And that's really when I began, I would say, the real healing journey, because before then, I thought I could just think my way out. I thought I could use mindset and personal development to just high vibe my way through the trauma and avoid the part where you actually feel.

Michael: Yeah, that doesn't work.

Kel: Yeah, no, that doesn't work. Hello, toxic positivity. That was me. I was, like, the high vibe chick. And it was incredibly toxic. And meanwhile, I had substance abuse problems. I was using drugs. I was basically snorting Adderall every single morning and a pharmaceutical crackhead because I could just be more productive and I could do more. And if I could do more than maybe I could finally feel like I was enough and I had addictions to exercising and I was always doing more and it was still never enough and eating disorders and all the things. I drank a lot of dumb bitch juice and dumb bitch juice is the metaphorical concoction of using things outside of yourself to change how you feel inside. And it wasn't until I allowed myself to just pause and COVID was that pause and to stop running and hiding from myself and allow myself to have the courage to peek beneath the covers of what I was really hiding from and see all that was still there, see the trauma, see the parts of myself that were carrying so much shame and pain and tracing that back all the way to childhood that I actually began. The real healing and reconnecting with my body and using somatic practices and real like true deep healing tools that I was able to actually start to experience the internal shifts that were necessary to change my external reality. And it was within transforming the relationship with myself that my life began to transform in a true, genuine way, not just Oh, it looks good on the outside again, but inside I still feel like shit. I still feel like I'm not enough. I still feel all this pain and shame, but I actually began to experience, love and compassion and inner peace and to not have panic attacks every single day, and it was a different experience in life, but it wasn't until I began to do that deep inner healing work.

Michael: I have, I actually, one, I appreciate you sharing that and I reflect a lot in that. Luckily for me, I had that experience much earlier when I was 30, I moved to Portland, Oregon, and I was single for the first time in my, since I was like 16 and for years. I was just alone and I forced myself in the discomfort of it. I would date here and there and maybe meet somebody, but I was in no relationships. And I kept realizing like, why do I keep attracting these same women? Because you are what you attract. And I'm like there's nothing wrong with these women. It's just that they're vibrating out of frequency that I no longer want to vibrate at. And so I'm sitting here in connection with them and I'm, and this was my friend's group too. I'm like, why are these people the opposite of what I want right now? And when I pulled myself back and I really started to evaluate it, I realized even though it was. Honestly, to this day, it was the most uncomfortable, lonely, isolating, painful, handful of years of my life. It is the only reason I was able to like, course correct and look, there's still work to be done. I'm still doing the work, I'm still unraveling decades of abuse and suffering and indoctrination and grooming and emotional incest and things like we don't even have time to get into right now, but the reality is in that space of being with oneself, you will discover who you are, whether you like it or not. And one of the things that you said, looking at coping with dumb bitch juice, which I think is hilarious, we do that in almost involuntarily because our brains are trying to help us survive. So it's like the coping mechanism, it's the next hit, the next drink, the next hookup, the next, whatever that thing is. It makes us feel safe, even though it's destroying our lives. And it's not until you choose to take a look at your actions and become cognizant that you realize it. And similar to you at one point at 28 years old, I was having panic attacks five times a day. It was absolutely crippling. But guess what? My lifestyle was drinking and smoking and drugs and hookups and hiding and running and not telling the truth and avoiding reality if somebody is listening to this right now and they're in this dark, ‘cause that's fucking dark Kel, like it's dark, like you've been there, I've been there. Almost nothing in life sucks more than waking up every day and realizing that you are the problem, where do you begin the healing journey? You talk about these experiences and these rock, bottoms and falling back into it. But where do you really truly start? If I'm like, fuck, I've left this relationship or I'm in this relationship and I have all these addictive behaviors and I keep dating the same people, my health wealth relationships are disaster. Where do I begin?

Kel: Yeah that's a great question and it can feel so impossible, it feels so impossible to be in that dark place and to feel like there's no light at the end of the tunnel. And if there is even like a little glimmer of a light, you're Like oh fuck, that's probably a train. It's just coming to take me out, like it just feels so hopeless.

Michael: And a great analogy.

Kel: I would say the number one thing is get support. You don't have to do this alone. It can feel so, so isolating, especially when we are carrying so much shame. And I carried a tremendous amount of shame about the experiences that I had, but shame really thrives and breathes in silence. And shame, I don't believe, is an emotion. I believe shame is a pattern, it's a program, that is designed to keep us stuck, and to limit us. So get support, reach out to a coach, a therapist, someone that can be a resource for you, and guide you, because you truly do not have to do it alone, and it's in having this support and recognizing that there are resources available to you, that you are able to start to take those baby steps. And think of it as just taking one, one step at a time. When we start to look at the bigger picture of, I'm here, I'm at A, and I want to get to Z, and all is fucking alphabet soup. It's I have a fork. I don't even know what to do with this. It's never going to happen. It's too much to think about getting from A to Z, literally go from A to B. What's one small step, what's one small way you can, be honest with yourself, love yourself, support yourself, create internal safety. Safety is so important in healing because when we are living in that space of survival mode, like we're not thriving, like if you're surviving, you're not thriving. And it very much is in that state of nervous system dysregulation where all your mind and body care about is keeping you safe. So starting to create ways to create that internal safety so that your nervous system can begin to deregulate and down regulate and actually create that space of Being in your parasympathetic nervous system, which is where healing occurs, which is where that sense of safety occurs. So looking at how you can create internal safety and stability, how can you meet your personal needs? So often we aren't even meeting our own personal needs when we're in that dark place because we're just feeling so stuck. So actually supporting yourself, beginning to take care of yourself. It's going to start to build self trust and you're going to show yourself that you have your own back.

Michael: Yeah. Let's go into that real quick, how do I know what my personal needs are? If I've been codependent, if I've been an overachiever, if I have done anything possible to get love, I've put everything before me, everyone before me. I'm always last, I have all these coping mechanisms. How the hell do I know what I need?

Kel: Yeah, that question resonates so deeply with me because that was me. And the first step is to actually just recognize that you have personal needs. Start there, just recognize I am a human, I have personal needs.

Michael: Can you define what a personal need is? Because I think that's where we're going to lose people. What is a need? What is it? What does that mean? I don't understand.

Kel: Yeah. So a need is something that is non-negotiable and there's a hierarchy of needs. So starting at the bottom, that's going to be our foundational needs, the needs for safety, the needs for our physical needs. So making sure we're getting enough sleep, making sure we're drinking enough water, making sure we're eating healthy foods. Making sure we have shelter, those are our basic needs, and so often people are like, I want to live my best life. I want to be self actualized, and it's bitch, you're not even drinking water or sleeping, you're not even meeting your basic needs, like you don't get to skip steps here. So Maslow created a hierarchy of needs. So actually using that as a reference and looking at, okay, what are my primary needs as a human and making sure that you're meeting those needs. And it's in actually recognizing, okay, I have personal needs, having personal needs doesn't make me needy. It makes me human, my personal needs are my responsibility. I'm not responsible for other people's needs, which was the pattern I lived my entire life, especially coming from a pattern of codependency, where it was like, Oh, I'm responsible for other people's needs, and they're responsible for my needs, which really just means you're abandoning yourself because no one's taking care of your personal needs, and that's very devastating to the relationship that you have with yourself because it's devastating. It destroys the trust within yourself. So start by recognizing that you have personal needs, actually get honest about what those needs are, and in any given moment, it could be as simple as setting an alarm on your phone as a check in with yourself, what do I need right now? what would support me? What would make me feel good? Am I getting enough sleep? Am I drinking water? Am I eating foods that actually make me feel good? Am I moving my body in a way that feels good? So starting with those really basic foundational human needs and then working your way up that hierarchy to actually make sure that you are meeting your lead, your needs on those multiple levels.

Michael: What were some of the needs that you had to fulfill for yourself?

Kel: Oh, like all of them. Yeah. Like even starting with like sleep, my routine was, I would basically just stay up, scrolling on my phone, smoking weed, doing all the things to distract myself until I would just pass out, and then I would wake up at 4am because I had this rigid morning routine where I was like, I gotta do all the things, or else I would have massive panic attacks.  And I would have massive panic attacks all day long anyway, but yeah, so even starting with sleep, recognizing, Oh shit, I wouldn't eat all day, and then I would come home and binge on food because I was starving. And then also I was trying to just suppress emotion. So really getting honest about the needs that I was not meeting are really challenging area for me was looking at my emotional needs because I was so disconnected from my emotions and I wasn't even allowing myself the space to feel my emotions, and then I was trying to be selective. I only wanted to feel the good emotions, and I'm using air quotes because emotions aren't good or bad. They're just neutral experiences that we give meaning to. And sure, some are more comfortable than others. But I was neglecting my emotional needs because I wasn't even allowing myself to feel because I was so disconnected.

Michael: Do you think that ties back into childhood?

Kel: 100%. Yeah. As a child I had such big feelings and emotions, I can remember not even wanting to watch like sports as a kid because I would feel so bad for the team that lost because they tried so hard. So I definitely identify as a highly sensitive person and I did not have the tools and the resources to really understand emotions and to navigate them and looking at my parents and my role models. I know that everyone is always doing the best that they can with their own internal resources. And they were disconnected from their emotions. So of course I became very disconnected from my emotions. And, even looking at in high school, I had experiences with depression and I had an incident where I actually overdosed on pills with the I don't want to say the intention of taking my life, but it was a cry for help. It was definitely a cry for help. And then, going to the psychiatrist and being put on antidepressants as, at a young age, as a teenager, and it was very much emotions are a problem to be solved, take this pill, we'll fix them. Use something outside of yourself to fix yourself. Which, again, just reinforced those underlying programs and patterns, so I truly was not equipped with the internal tools to navigate all of the emotions that I was experiencing, which, subsequently, my emotional intelligence was, like, non existent because I was so disconnected from myself.

Michael: Young age, like I just learned how to turn off the emotions because it was survival. Part of it was also growing up in an abusive home where crying was basically a death sentence. And so I learned how to turn off and I didn't cry for 15 years in the loss of both my mother, my grandmother, my three childhood best friends who got murdered, I didn't shed it. And for me, like learning how to cry again, like that was such an intense experience and it only came through this isolation we're talking about, I had to sit and deal with me and it's so hard because you don't like you don't want to, there's no part of me that's ever it's great, let me go to therapy three times a week, but it's also what else is the alternative? Because the actions that you've taken, the thoughts that you have, the mindset that you believe, has brought you to where you are, and to think that you're going to pull yourself out of that and have a different life is a lie. And every time I hear people who are just like, I can meditate or will myself and change, it's no you can't. No human in history has ever changed their life by themselves. It just doesn't work that way, and I want to empower people to have the willingness to ask for help because like I see you and what you do now and you've had this incredible energetic shift where it goes from You have no self worth and what you do is tied externally, your appearance, your relationship, the car you drive to now you have a very different lifestyle, right? It is internal validation, it is internal self worth, and I resonate with that in so many ways because instead of 500 dinners and 100,000 cars and fancy clothes, I'm like, can I just connect with somebody on a real valid human level? But most importantly, Can I just understand that nothing in the world will ever break is so interesting. I was just talking about this, nothing in the world will ever bring you worth other than the mirror. How did you develop yourself worth and move away from all of these external things that you were trying to get validation from? What was that process?

Kel: And it really was the byproduct of doing the inner work to understand the programs and patterns that I was living, and healing from childhood trauma, recognizing that we have these parts of ourselves and these parts of ourselves develop these coping mechanisms and patterns and we are conditioned to look for our self worth outside of ourselves and you will never see yourself worth if you're trying to use your external circumstances to reflect it and it becomes this external seeking and searching and it drains your personal power. It literally is draining your own life force energy and it's in just allowing yourself to notice like, okay, what am I using to define my personal? Sense of self-worth, is it my car? Is it the shoes? Is it my appearance? There was a point in my life where I recognized, fuck, I can't even go out in public without putting on a full face of makeup because my sense of self-worth and my identity was so attached to my appearance and how I looked. And it was in recognizing the ways that I was using things external of myself to see self worth and. anchoring in on my values. What's actually important to me? Where is what is self worth? And recognizing in this very moment, exactly as you are innately worthy, think about a baby, when a baby is born, a baby cries, people come over, it's the cutest thing, people come over to visit the baby, all the baby does is eat, sleep, and shit, and it's oh, this baby is this gift, and that is the truth, so it really is this matter of stripping away and unbecoming and just remembering who the fuck you are, like you are worthy of all the best things in life, but life doesn't give you what you deserve, life gives you what you tolerate, and what you tolerate is a reflection of your standards and what you believe about yourself. And it's in getting honest with yourself and recognizing where you are settling for less than you deserve, where you are looking for things outside of yourself to validate yourself, where are you prioritizing external validation over internal self acceptance. And so often we say, Oh, we have this fear of rejection, right? The person that we are most afraid of the rejection from is actually ourselves and it's in accepting ourself, accepting all the parts of ourselves and understanding that no part of you is an accident. Every aspect of yourself, every pattern, every program, your appearance, all the way down to your fucking pinky toe was decided by your soul. And all of this is what makes you, and it's in. learning and accepting these parts of yourself and recognizing where you are outsourcing that personal power that allows you to reconnect with your self worth and to reconnect with the truth of who you are. But it requires honesty. It requires commitment. It requires you to choose yourself. Not just once, but in every single moment and in every single moment to let that be a portal to see, Oh, what is my external reality reflecting? What is that showing about myself? And how can I truly just love and accept myself more in these moments? Even if it means getting honest with myself about the role that I'm playing in my life and what's being reflected back at me.

Michael: That's true wisdom. It really is, and there's a lot to be taken from that, and I would have probably given very much the same answer, especially growing up a boy who learned how to be codependent, who was emotionally enmeshed, who was groomed into you. But yeah. Really a very feminine energy and having to figure out like in becoming a healed man, becoming a healed, masculine human being, becoming this person who is constantly on the journey. ‘Cause trust me, I fuck up. It's like everything that you just said is how I got here, and it is so much about putting yourself first and the willingness to do so is going back to this thing about shame. So here's the dichotomy of shame in the way that I believe that it can be used as like this really interesting pillar to create change, especially if you're where I were, if you are where I was, that shame can often be a catapult on the other side of it. This is the juxtaposition, people feel shame about putting themselves first. That is indoctrination, that is lies, that is grooming, and what I will hope people will take away from everything that you just said is recognizing that you should not feel shame about being you, you should not feel shame about whether or not you are able to be the person that you know, you're capable of being. ‘Cause life is very long and you're probably not there yet. And more can you not feel shame about saying no. The code of the codependence favorite jug is yes. And it's like, how do we get you away from that? And it's really about this idea of understanding your worth, you are worthy, you deserve everything you want in life. However, and this is the part people don't want to hear, this is the little secret, you got to be disciplined, you have to show up, you have to be honest, you have to execute and nobody cares if you do it or not. And that is the hardest part about this journey, when you do the little things at home, putting the dishes away because you said you were going to do it, brushing your teeth before bed, not watching porn, not eating gummy bears, not playing video games, not smoking cigarettes, not snorting Adderall, when you say that these are the things I'm going to do, that's how you build who you are. And nobody is going to come pat you on the back because I don't know about you, but I never remember anybody coming and be like, good job, kid. You did the dishes, right? And so the reality is you want to build that worth. It really comes down to discipline and It comes down to you choosing you. And I know how difficult it is, trust me, I get it, I'm not speaking anything other than my own truth. When I was in the worst position of my entire life, I did nothing that you just said. And then I look at my life now and it's completely different. When you're working with people, and you're guiding these incredible women that you work with, and you see their lives transform, what are some of the commonalities that you see in people who actually create change in their life?

Kel: Yeah, it is. It is very much that commitment to themselves because it's not easy. It's not an easy journey. It's the most beautiful journey you all will ever take this journey of healing and discovering who you really are. But it's not easy, especially when not everyone is going to support your journey because a lot of people benefit from you not changing. And it's really challenging for people, especially who have patterns of people pleasing and codependency to then accept the role of I might be a villain in somebody else's story because I changed and I'm now a mirror and really amplifying the changes that they're not willing to make within themselves. And it's in just honoring your truth. And the personal responsibility factor is huge because I feel like that's the number one reason that most people don't change because it's really difficult to actually accept personal responsibility. But personal responsibility is how you step back into your personal power because you're no longer a victim of the external circumstances. It's cool, I created this life, this is awesome. Now I get to change it. Now I get to change it, I don't need to wait for someone else to change. I don't need to wait for circumstances to change, I get to make these changes, and it's viewing this journey from that place of empowerment, not of oh man, I really fucked shit up. This sucks. That happened to me and that happened to me, it's no, cool. This is actually really cool, look at this. That happened, I get to learn more about myself and actually just getting excited about it and coming from it, from that place of empowerment and actually just prioritizing it, prioritizing yourself, because the more you prioritize yourself, the more that life prioritizes you. So it really is this balance of your commitment to yourself, the willingness to accept personal responsibility from that place of love, compassion, curiosity, and not shame, and just the willingness to keep trying, just to keep showing up, the healing journey, it's not linear, it's a fucking roller coaster, it's a spiral, and knowing that it's all happening. On purpose, for a purpose, and it really is guiding you to who you're meant to be, and the good news is that life is just going to keep teaching you the same lessons over and over again until you learn them. Life is really just a classroom, and it's cool, okay, I'm in grade, I don't know, let's just say I'm in 8th grade, I want to get to 9th grade. There are lessons that I need to learn, and there's going to be tests, and when we pass those tests, we get those energetic upgrades, and then it's I'm no longer available for that. But until we actually learn the lessons that life is teaching us, we're going to keep repeating the past and it's there's really only two options in life it's so simple that we complicate it. You can either repeat or you can evolve and Evolving and actually learning the lessons that life is teaching you is the journey of spirituality It's the journey of discovering who you are, it's the journey of stepping into your full potential and discovering your own unique gifts that you're here to share with the world and the world needs you like the world needs you to be you the world needs you to heal the world needs you to actually become who you're meant to be so that way we can shift the consciousness of humanity and collectively Expand and evolve together.

Michael: Yeah, I agree with that and the truth is what the world may need from you may not be being a celebrity or a Podcaster or writing books or speaking or coaching? It may just be showing up in the truest most authentic version of you this is the same reason why when you really connect with someone it's because you have authenticity. It's because you're not lying It's because you're not bullshitting It's because you're  sitting across from him and you're saying, this is who I am. And there are people who will take it and people who will leave it. And that is just the nature of life. But the most important thing is that when you look in the mirror, you are okay with the reflection. And if you can get to that, you really win the game. This has been an awesome conversation. I love this. I really hope people take this and bring it into their heart and do something with it because knowledge without action is bullshit. But before I ask you my last question, where can everyone find you and learn more about you.

Kel: Yeah. So I am on Instagram @IamKelCal. I also have my podcast, Dear Dumb Bitch, and my first book will be published on March 12th, which is very exciting.

Michael: And what's the name of that book?

Kel: My book is called How I Cured My Resting Bitch Face. Your guide to stop settling, fall in love with yourself, and create a life you're obsessed with.

Michael: Yeah, guys, let's make sure we go get that support. This has been a phenomenal conversation. I know the book is going to be full of gems. I can't wait to read it. You need to send me a copy for sure. My last question for you, my friend. What does it mean to you to be unbroken?

Kel: What does it mean to be unbroken? It means to recognize that you were never broken in the first place. You were not something to be fixed.

Michael: to the point? I love it. Thank you so much for being here on broken nation. Thank you for listening guys. Remember to check out thinkunbrokenpodcast.com where you can get a free copy of my book. Join our online community. I do free coaching sessions at any time with anybody in the world. So make sure you check out and take advantage of that.

And Until Next Time,

My Friends,

Be Unbroken.

I'll See Ya.