E302: Relationships, trauma, depression and healing with Ana Lennyr | Trauma Healing Podcast

Michael: Hey! What's up, Unbroken Nation! Hope that you're doing well wherever you are in the world today. I'm very excited to be back with you with another episode with my guest Ana Lennyr who is a premier life strategist, I’m very excited for this episode. Ana, how are you today, my friend?

Ana: I'm doing great! Thank you, Michael for inviting me.

Michael: Yeah, it's my pleasure. You and I spoke a couple of months ago and I just felt so compelled by not only your story but your mission and what it is that you're trying to do and create in the world. And before we get in too deep, tell us a little bit about your back story and how you got to where you are today?

Ana: Yeah. I have one of those sad stories that I don't like to tell very often even know it goes just because it's not very unique, it's involving a lot of people even today in the world. So, it looks like a story but it's more like a universal story where child wakes up depressed around the age of seven or so then end up with that depression and taking him to or her in my case at the age of nineteen to a suicidal attempt, headaches, migraines, insomnia for two and a half years.

So, one of those lives that has been starting with suffering, right?

So, after I saw that this stuff doesn't work but I have a problem and I need to solve it, I went to university of psychology trying to fix myself, I have succeeded because there were no skills there. I lost my mom to alcoholism and depression; she was fifty-five when she died overnight.

So, at the age of thirty-eight my life equals suffering, very simple with all kind of physical issues and all kind of depressive issues and anxiety issues until I decided to take charge of it, to not leave my kid to this generational depression as a victim and I succeed to overcome depression in seven months and today I teach to that formula to people of that I work with.

Michael: Well, that's really powerful. And you know, I think that there's part of me that agrees with you to a very interesting extent. There's unfortunately kind of a lack of uniqueness in our shared experience and you know obviously you and I speak before, you know my background everyone listening does as well and I think that's incredibly unfortunate that we live in a society where it's more alcohol, is a more depression more abuse more of that and ultimately that becomes the cornerstone for this show. I think that Ana there's a lot of people who are listening right now who are suffering through depression, who are suffering through the generational trauma, who are trying to figure out kind of like man, like where do I start, what are the first steps, you know and they hear somebody like, you say well, I was able to do this in seven months and they're like, I've been depressed for seventeen years. Where do you start at, where is the beginning of this process at?

Ana: The beginning of this process is deciding to stop suffering, okay? So, when I went to my mentors and I said listen, I want to live one week happy before I die because my mom never had this chance. The first question we asked is how old are you? I'm like, thirty-eight. Are you thirty-eight or eighty-three, right? Because you feel like, eighty-three years old when you are suffering from depression for over twenty-seven years of your life, this is how you feel, every day is a struggle, right? But here is you start with making the decision but listen this needs to end, it has been enough, it has been taken enough of me, it's ready to kill me.

I had five my job, my son was hearing me from the couch to a bathroom we're talking about that eight-and-a-half-year-old headaches, migraines, pre national alcoholic, hepatitis, pre diabetes or obesity, this all the age of thirty-eight, I mean what else can it happen to your age of thirty-eight, I mean come on let's face it, right? So, the first thing that I did is acknowledge that listen, everything I tried by myself it doesn't work, time to stop what I thought it's working and to start doing what it's truly working with a help I need. So, here it's starting of making a decision to get out of the situation.

Michael: Yeah. And in that decision, you know, what I think is interesting about that as even thinking about my own journey it really truly was just making a choice, you said something about choosing not to suffer. I think unfortunately we're so trapped in that and people will hear this but you know it feels impossible just to choose, is it as simple as just being like, I'm choosing this? Can it actually be that easy?

Ana: So, you are choosing this, okay, number one and then you're also choosing not to bring your way of thinking into the problem, right? For example, my mom was a teacher, I was very educated, I finished two universities in the same time, I finished psychology; university of psychology where I finished with a scholarship, I thought I knew it all and when I went to my mentor they said, yeah, you know all about suffering or the only thing you don't know is about how to live, right? So, here when you make the decision you make a decision to leave your way of, I know it on two and start brand new, no, I don't know anything about the game of life because they are more or is master a game of life. And this was the truth, I didn't know anything about the game of life, I knew everything about the game of suffering, right? So, you make the decision, don't bring that baggage of thinking that I know it all into the problem and start at zero, no, I don't know anything clearly, I don't know anything because I'm suffering, right? So, let's start from zero, let's learn how to walk. And this is exactly what I do when I work with people my formula is first relationships; master relationships with yourself and others because this is the first bicycle, you're gonna get on into the world it doesn't matter at what age and we people who have been suffering for depression and anxiety this is the first thing we don't have; relationships skills.

Michael: Let's go into that a little bit more because I would agree and when I go back and I think about kind of the crux of the beginning of this journey for me it was really fascinating to look at kind of coming to terms with the fact that so many people in my life have been telling me, you're a terrible friend, you're a terrible brother, you don't show up, you don't follow through, you take advantage of people, you're not someone that we can trust or rely on and it became really evident to me that two things happen in my life (one) is I became the polar opposite of all of those things over a long enough period of time, let me be clear but (two) I noticed that a lot of the people who I bought quote unquote, I was friends with that mattered and it's not that they don't matter it's just like they weren't bringing value in my life, they're bringing no substance. I think people feel so often and I'll speak for myself, I felt so often at the time especially in the beginning of this like, the most important thing for me to do was make everybody like me was to feel like, I mattered because they thought I mattered. So, with relationships being first and why don't we dive into that and why don't you clarify (a) what do you mean by relationships and then how do they play into this game of life?

Ana: So, many people, you know as you were labeled, it's like, you're not a good friend which means like toxic or something, right? So, a lot of times people come to me, said oh, I have this all this toxic environment, I'm like, no, you do not have a toxic environment, you have people around you who are in a tremendous amount of pain and to help with that first of all you don't have to take over their pain and then you have to see their pain to separate from it, and to see where the triggers are. But in case of relationships, we're talking about a simple thing, number one misconceptions like, you have to make everybody happy before you are happy and this happened during COVID and it got accelerated because guess what? Now that you can make anybody happy and you of yourself you realize that you are the one hurt that is nobody else to blame. And the second thing that I see over time is that most people do not know that they are four types of men and four types of women in the world. I know we all wanna be unique and different and all of that, I am one of the four types of women, okay? Michael, you are one of our four types of men in the world, right? And when I teach these four types of men and four types of women to my clients, they realize that each type has its own values in life, has its own way of thinking, has its own priorities in life, right? And because they realize that now they don't blame themselves or the other type for a different way of thinking or a different approach, right? I have a lot of women come to me and they said, oh my god, my husband abandons me and left new this scared and you know never cares about me and never pays child support and stuff like that and I ask them, is that an airman, right? And like, what do you mean is like, this has this characteristic of woman who likes freedom, who likes business, who likes money, well that's not a meant for the family, right? So, if you know this from the beginning as a woman but this particular man is not built for family, you gonna worry about marrying him, you don't worry about having a kid with him because that's not the proper man and that's not to blame that type of men it's just that has different values in life and you cannot change people, you can only accept their values and maneuver work towards what you want.

After two divorces by the age of thirty eight, I found the relationships that I teach to today were most enlighten to absolutely everybody because we all go on misconceptions about love, thinking that love is just gonna come in and he's just gonna complete us and after two, three years we found out that it's actually the opposite, it's here to hurt us and that's because we don't understand these four types of men, four types of women they are archetypes between them and how people don't come into our life to hurt us. People come with different values we think that everybody thinks like us, that's the only problem, right? So, here is like, I think everybody should think like me and then no wonder, no, oh everybody thinks like me, there are another three types of women in a world there, another four types of men. So, here I teach people – listen; what do you want? What I want this? Okay. This is the type of person you want, to get this type of person you need to be this, right? So, here is how do you arrange yourself in the system of life, in the cycle of life to find what you truly want and how you can be complete. Don't expect another to complete you. So, in case of relationships I find the most illuminating in the world, you know, these kind of four types of men, four types of women we had somebody very a young kid like, I think I'm depressed, I went it to a thousand date and I can't find anybody, what is wrong with me? I'm like, I haven't there's anything wrong with you, I don't think you're depressed either I think you don't know who you are and who you're looking for. Here, do this three-and-a-half-hour course and then call me, after two weeks he called me and said, I already found after eight dates my fiancé, I was like okay, what I guess the course worked for you, okay? You haven't even out to ask for advice, right? Because if you don't know who you're looking for and who you are. You're gonna end up in messed up relationships, there four types of relationships that don't work and two that work if you saw one type that doesn't work, you're gonna end up in the other three that don't work because this is how the cycle works, you need to learn from all four.

So, here I give a formula to people from here, listen, forget about what doesn't work this is what works, so just do it. Period. And everybody said, is too easy, okay, try it, is easy but it's gonna save you from two divorces, gonna save you from twenty years of your life of worrying about other people not liking you that includes not only your partner, your boss, your parents, your kids, your coworkers, right? Because the relationships is everything these four types of men women there everything not this is sadly enough partners, right? But a lot of people come to me because they're heart broken and they're afraid to find other people because guess what? They don't know this is them of how to master the relationships. So, that's what I found it, the most enlighten thing in the world, most people are not even depressed they just have been heartbroken and they don't know how to find their themselves in a relationship with themselves or others or how to find the person that they really want in life.

Michael: Yeah. And I wanna go into what those archetypes are a little bit more, a little bit deeper. One of the things that came to mind as you were going through that is so my mentor Tom Bilyeu taught me something really important about this idea collision of values in relationships and it being missed thing where because you lack a tremendous amount of clarity about who you are and what you want and vice versa from the other person you're gonna be like, a head and collision just waiting to happen. And so, I'd love for you to dive into a little bit deeper about these archetypes so that folks listening can have a little bit of a better understanding. Now obviously we can't give people a three-and-a-half-hour course in thirty-five minutes but we can give a little bit of context so I'd love if you dive into those a little bit more and then specifically talks about the kind of relationships that do work because I agree with you focus on why focus doesn't work when we should be focusing on what does.

Ana: So, four types of them, we like to make these energies in elements because it's easier to consume, right? So, four types I call them water, fire, air and earth because they're easy to consume. So, the four types of men, I would be lot would be the creator, visiting engineers, designers, artists, right? And there are people who the first value in life is their creation, this is why they live for they're like the Michael Angelo’s of the world, okay? Michael Angelo didn't care about the family, didn't care about kids, didn’t care about business. Michael Angelo didn't care about any of this, he cared about painting, he cared about cult, right? This is what's his contribution to society. So, this is the creator mode in man specifically and it's extraordinary because you need that because this is how ideas come into the world, this is how the world comes into place with no ideas there is nothing, right? We don't even have a computer we're talking about right now, right? So, that's my first type of man.

The second type of man is with fire man, that has a lot of energy it's like the manager, its always organizing thing, it's always kept you going, it has passion, he has driven and you see this in people as then go, go, go go, go and sometimes you're like, really when you wanna keep going is an entirely? Now you need that drive, you need that passion to propel yourself into the world, to do something because with no drive you're not gonna do anyting in life, right?

But the third type of men is the air men, this specific type of men is not concentrated on family, is not concentrated on kids, on life or anything like that compared to a fire man who puts his wife as first in priority level. This man puts his wife last in the priority level, right? And everybody because there's so attractive and businessman there love freedom, they have hobbies, they have friends, they have money, you know, all women are attracted to this type of men not realizing that this is not a good man for marriage which is good meant for having fun, alright? But these are the entrepreneurs of the world, the visionary of the world, these are the Elon Mask of the world, where you need that drive to propel the society forward as others are going to follow, this is the men that we're put into application ideas that are impossible to do and it makes it possible, right?

The fourth type of men it's the earth man and that we call them kings because they are men who take care of domain, of their family, of their business, of their community, their people who work in the military and government and nine to five jobs and these are stable man. They also can be extremely aggressive if they have a lot of traumas and these are men and women are afraid of because they're aggressive but this is only one type of men of the world, right? So, this is only twenty five percent of men. So, this is why you know here, who do you want in your life? Go and pick it, if you know who you want in your life instead of just waiting for one to come up and guess what? It comes up to hardship, right?

Now let's talk about four types of women because I know that comes up to but first type water women is the princess it's Bambi energy, it needs a lot of attention, it has a lot of emotions, it also has a lot of love with them it's like these little young stupid women that are always smiling and they never worry about anything but they are so how should I say full of love and they so refreshing, right? So, into the world you need that, you don't need all the time tension, tension also these women are the first one that gonna slip in depression if they have any kind of emotional one, okay? Because they're emotional are high level.

The second type of woman is the mistress you see them in actresses, were dress sexy, they're all the time on high heels that all the time looking good for themselves. They are very like, attraction they like, to be exquisite, to be admired they like that like, Angelina Jolie, right?

They like these kinds of things.

The third type of woman is the queen the air woman and these are CEO’s of companies, they also don't have too much intentions in families and kids they will do it, they type of women but how should I say very intimidating, right? So, men are intimidated dating them because they're just like, gonna cut hats, they look at all that, they do a job but they are busy they are very, very into the men's world to compete with them, alright? And then four types of women is the mother it's the one with takes care of garden, the soccer tournament, look kids, the dogs, the pets, the raining house, so this is the earth for woman.

All these types of men and women have their own place in the world, they have their own values in life. When you go and pick in society who do you want to be? We are more comfortable with and who do you want to have in your life you need to know this stuff because they are different dynamics between all of them.

Michael: Yeah and what comes to mind and hearing this is I think to myself oh, there's a little bit of me and each one of these but there's also this dominant side or I go like, yes, I think of myself and that Elon Musk type where it's like, I'm entrepreneurial, I'm driven, I'm a business person but I’m also like kind and compassion and server of my community and you know maybe I wanna have a family one day and so on and so forth but as whereas like, you have this artist type, I go maybe a little bit but mainly the entrepreneur side, right? And I think that's really important because in my own journey I've learned that creates a collision of values when the other person doesn't understand like this is the type and I'll be cleared probably not within the last three years that I've really been able to convey that and I think if people will go back and listen to what you just said they'll get a little bit more clarity about who they are because we are constantly in this struggle of trying to have an understanding of who we are and I love the simplification. Like, I’m comfortable with the idea that there are like four boxes because it helps me as an analytical type a person go, okay, cool, right? And because you know, you have the enneagram and you have the Myers Briggs and you have all these different tests and I'm like, yeah but there's so many freaking variables if you just can be four things and help this be easier, that's great. So, now laying out these archetypes, how does one navigate this in the real world? Because you said, these different ways that relationships don't work but there's this way that it does work and I'd love for you to go into that a little bit.

Ana: Yes, so, now here we go. You have any kind of emotional wounding that hasn't been addressed like rejection, abandonment, humiliation, betrayal, justice this perfection any of these you're going to find another broken person into your life. Broken attracts broken. It’s a law of attraction, you attract who you are that's why you have to be unbroken this is why we're exactly at podcast because this is how you want to be unbroken.

Number one, healed.

Number two, when you between all these four elements by learning how to maneuver between them not to judge them and said no, I will never be this. Learn from each person into your life not consider that each person attacks you, they're here to hurt you, right?

So, here is the dynamic of everybody that comes into my life that I don't agree with it's here to teach me something.

What am I missing?

How am I not seeing this from their perspective, from their values?

What is the lesson here?

This is how more balanced you are exactly like you mentioned I have a little bit of everything, yes, you have to have a little bit of everything because that's the actual balance, that's actually you live for to learn to have a little bit of everything but not having any kind of emotional wounding because that will attract somebody emotionally wounded and collapse. So, for perfect relationships now is like how do you go into the strengths of these elements a little bit in everybody? And how you find somebody with saying in the strengths of elements not emotionally you know stable? How do you learn from everybody and how do you make this a complete part of yourself? Because you don't expect another to complete you, the other is only here to teach you how to complete yourself.

Michael: Yeah, that's powerful. And I think people need to hear that. You know, when I think about I wanna create some framework here, right? This idea of like, you would bring into your life that in which you are holds so incredibly true and so if you're sitting here and your life is a disaster chances are your relationship gonna be a disaster like, I literally, I won't go into details but my relationship when I was twenty four, twenty five years old was so incredibly unbelievably, unacceptable like when I think about who I am today, I say, there is no way I would ever be in anything like that, you could pay me to be in that kind of relationship, right?

Ana: You wouldn't even active on Hollywood…

Michael: I wouldn't, it's feel uncomfortable, right? But in that the thing that I came to realize was I'm getting exactly what I want, I'm getting what I want. So, let's go into this a little bit deeper, and I don't know so let's have a little bit of parlay here. Do you think that it's necessary to heal to get the relationship that you want?

Ana: When you suffer from a rejection, betrayal, abandonment, you're gonna develop a codependency situation or a dependency situation.

So, this is why it's important to heal because otherwise without realizing you cling to another like, I cannot live without you and can be a parent not necessarily, can be a child, can be not necessarily a partner. I'm not gonna be able to live without this job, I'm not gonna be able to live without him/her or my child, my parents and this comes only from emotional wounding; you either have been rejected, abandoned, betrayed the past, you haven't healed from these things and now you cling to something thinking that this is the only way, alright?

So, this is why in my opinion it's very important to heal because you don't want to go on a direct struggle all the time with yourself. When in trying to maintain the balance of healthier relationships you want to do this at some point in the unconscious level, not only consciously. Well, I know he doesn't want me when I know he prefers business and money and stuff like that but I still want to get married, I still want to have kids, I'm still gonna be the relationship with him for ten years and then after ten years I figured out that okay, well, that's not right man for me, always knew that and now he wasted ten years of my life or I wasted ten years of my life and now whether there is blame and that it's shame and that is guilty involved and there is all these dynamics involved, right? So, this is why it's important it's very, very, very good to my opinion to come clean slate, right? I hear the ones of rejection, abandonment codependency, so, I am not gonna be afraid now to attract the narcissistic to my life because I'm not hurt anymore and I'm not gonna find somebody hurt anymore and if I do find somebody hurt, I'm gonna be able to recognize it and stay away from this person, not getting to a relationship of this person. So, this is why it's important, sometimes we come with this wound. I came with all of these from generations of my family, okay? So, depression is a lot of times of generational condition, sometimes it's triggered by betrayal of heartbreak but for me it came from generations of my family, right?

So, I have to make peace with myself not only with who I am but with exactly men in my life because I was abandoned by my father and it was a deep anger inside me about it and then wondering why I was divorced two times and betrayed and stuff like that because that anger somehow attracted another person in pain but was doing exactly the same, hurt me right? So, here is you need to make peace with yourself, with the universe, whoever people around you. Sometimes even with people who you believe they hurt you. For example, because I was abandoned by my father, I was considered myself you know hurt by him and when I put myself in his situation, would you live with an alcoholic woman just for a child? And I said, no, I would. Do you see his perspective now Michael, I mean, I was feeling hurt but he was feeling hard to stay with a now alcoholic woman for a child too, so he escaped, right? I couldn't escape because I was a kid, I wanted to escape I ended up depressed because of it but here is nobody too care of a mother to tell her, listen these are emotional ones you can hear, keep your husband and not put your kid depression, this is why I do what I do today.

Michael: Yeah, and that's so powerful. And I think about the truth of the power of what you said, I want people to really understand that because one of the things that has probably been arguably one of the most beneficial understanding of my life was I looked at my mother who was a drug addict and alcoholic, whose life was a complete and under disaster who was totally destroyed and I thought to myself oh, now it took me a long time, be clear took me a very long time to understand this but what I eventually did come to understand which actually helped me to let go of so much of the chaos of that was I just simply looked at her life and I said, well of course she's an alcoholic, look how her mother treats her, she's still hurt, she still wounded, she has not done the work and the depths of the darkness. I was actually talking to a client recently and I said the truth about this is, you have to be willing to walk into the darkness to see the light. And the more you drink, the more you smoke, the more you have sex, the more you do all these things what inevitably happens is you're dampening your light, you're just making it darker and darker and darker and to your point about choice it very much is that and so what I recognized was I had to choose to acknowledge that my mother and my father and my step my family and my community and generations before me we're all hurt people. And you hear that old adage hurt people-hurt people, well, you know what, healed people, healed people and so there's Yin and yang to all of this and I want people to know like this isn't about casting judgment on them like, I don't sit here awake from a throne and rain down up on them it's more of an acknowledgment of simply sitting in and looking at it acknowledging it and say yes, this the reality, this is what happened. For people who are listening, who maybe aren't there yet, who haven't it yet started to face that reality and they have not recognized the impact of whether it's their family system or their relationship, like what steps where can they find out more about what it means to be able to really come into truth is the way that I would phrase it?

Ana: So, before I answer this question. You know, you mentioned a little bit about when you were young for relationships were a mess right? But one of the things with deal with we have two parts of our company if you wanna call it this way so, one part is set up in overcoming anxiety for adults in teenagers and other part is concentrating and I'm gonna start probably doing life events and stuff like that in preventing this; in preventing a child from going towards this route which is not an easy route to heal after that of preventing because if you don't prevent this you know, you can get a million people out of depression every year like, maybe suicidal there are, right? So, when I was on stage just in December with Jessica Lowndes, Julian Michaels, JP Fox somebody came to me and my youngest customer was six years old, just a couple of months ago, I had the youngest customer suicidal at the age of six, alright? So, here we need to understand that this generation is accelerating and we can prevent this.

We can prevent this teaching them specific skills and I'll talk about it but the first thing we need to understand is that until the age of twenty-five, a child sets up a specific cycle, it sees from the parents or from a society or from the family around a specific type of cycle. If that cycle is a suffering cycle, it is pain, there is depression, there is an argument and a divorce, there is a divorce going on, that is relationship problems, abuse, any kind of mess up, right? It's gonna take that cycle and copy and paste it during their lifetime two more times and here is how we gonna live all their life, okay? So, we can change this up to the age of twenty five where we can break for cycle and show the kid that okay we've been through all of this, as parents as you know society but guess what? There is a different type of cycle. Let me show you what cycle you can have; a cycle when you get along with everybody, when you're not wounded, when you have now emotionally instability, when you have no relationship almost take that cycle and go repeated it, alright?

So, here is very, very important to me, Michael that we are preventing this from happening. To do this, there are three types of skills that people need to learn first of all is the relationship skills that we talked to, that's the first thing because you need to know who you are, who you need relationship with as yourself and then who the people are around you, they're not here to attack you they're here to teach you things, right? Any trigger is an opportunity of growth, any trigger, right? It tells you what you haven't healed yet.

The second part is emotional balance and we have anxiety, we have worry and we have anger that would teach the kids but there deeper emotional wounds like you mentioned you know, rejection and shame and the humiliation and embarrassment and betrayal and abandonment, these have to do blame, guilt, right? So, there is a lot of emotional wounds that come from generation and they hold you down they absolutely hold you down. For example, in my culture to be a salesman was very shameful, okay? Do you see why that culture is not gonna ever be able to get out of poverty, okay? Because it's shameful to be a salesman, alright? You're not here to steal you’re here to help people, the product that may need, that's why you need salesman in the world. You see how this generational eighty years old things keep down not only you, it keeps out an entire society.

The third one is mind traps. I always teach my clients mind traps which you slip in all the time they're about seventeen of them and you keep on sabotaging yourself over and over and over again without even realizing but first mind travel that everybody is I can't. Everybody that comes to me is like, you could get out of depression, I can't, that's the first line trip they fall into. If somebody, did it before you, yes you can, if nobody did before you, you can be the first one. Stop making excuses, stop falling into that mind trap that's gonna keep you in suffering another couple of decades to figure it out that out, oh, I just wasted half of my life in depression. But second mind trap is when you find excuses, I can but I don't have time. You don't have three and a half hours of your life to master relationships but you have two years’ time to divorce, right? I mean if you look at it all kind of excuses, why you don't want to grow and expand you wanna stay in pain and suffering. Now you need to master the game of life because you already master a game of suffering, right?

So, these are the three major skills when I tell everybody you need to have grasp on it, there are vulnerable skills. There are people that you have noticed in this society where they never get depressed it's because they have these skills, they're born with them. The ones they slipped like we do, we need to learn them, it's not gonna be idea it's just like a skill that you're learning in school like, math, right? It's not of a major thing going on. I make it as simple as possible for people but yes you need these three skills relationships, emotional skills and mindset skills to get out of a jail of depression this is how I call, it's a jail. You need to snap out of air and be able to move in life and find not only find your true potential but achieve your true potential because to be honest since I overcame depression and I'm doing this job of people. I accomplished more than three generations of my family.

Michael: It's amazing and I'm so struck by that. One of the things that comes to mind as you said that is you know it is a jail, it is, it really truly is but what's really fascinating is the cell is actually unlocked and all you gotta do is walk through the damn door, right? And I wish people would understand that, we are only imprisoned by what we decide to be imprisoned by and yes, it's difficult and yes it's hard no but he's ever gonna disagree that this sucks and it's hard and it's tumultuous and you have to climb a hill to get what you want but you know what it really starts with just walking through that door.

Ana: To be honest it's harder to stay in this pain Michael, they took get out of it. Come on man seven months compared to twenty-seven years of suffering?

Michael: Yes, and it all starts with the decisions you make right now. Ana, my friend this conversation has been incredible before I ask you my last question can you tell everyone where they can find you?

Ana: So, they can find me on my website analennyr.com nevertheless nobody knows how to spell my name, so we have a better website for you, it's called betteraskana.com where they can find everything for free courses for children, for parents how to get their child out of depression the entire formula it's for free and an hour and a half course for free. Have a secret mapped overcome depression for adults for free. We have workshops for free, so, one of the things that people in depression are afraid of is being sold, having to pay something for things okay, so this is why we have a website with all resources for free at betteraskana.com because podcaster like you raise awareness, yes, it's everybody's choice to make a decision but we don't want people to have excuses that it costs one dollar, we want them to have choices.

Michael: Yep. I agree, I'm right there with you, that's why everyone knows everything that Think Unbroken teaches is on this show for free. So, Ana, thank you, I appreciate that of course we are gonna put all the links in the show notes for the Unbroken Nation. Please go and research and check this out. My last question for you my friend, what does it mean to you to be unbroken?

Ana: To change the world Michael, this is what I do like, prevent depression. I heard people overcoming it, right? But the most important to grow and expand every day that's you one thing you cannot do in the jail of the depression.

Michael: Yes, very true. Thank you for that I agree could not agree more in fact we appreciate you being here.

Unbroken Nation, thank you for listening.

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