The Unbreakable Mindset and Overcoming Childhood Trauma: Michael Unbroken on How To Not Get Sick And Die Podcast

Matty: What's up my healthy friends, how you doing? I hope you're nodding joyously and that you're somewhere that you can settle down to absorb this episode because what we're going to be talking about plays a deep and integral part in many of my clients journey when it comes to getting control of themselves and their relationship with food and sugar. And that's why in 2023, it's my mission to coach 500 people to stop the binge eating and savage self talk cycle so they can lose weight whilst feeling in control and without restriction along the way.

Trauma, PTSD, or painful and horrific childhood experiences are often the birthplace of life's seemingly most unhelpful personality traits, coping mechanisms, and survival tactics. And that's why I want to introduce you to someone with a very special story and an even more important mission. From homeless to hero, Michael Anthony is the founder of Think Unbroken, which we'll get into throughout this conversation. He's a serial entrepreneur, best-selling author, and award winning speaker, a podcast host, like all legendary individuals, a business coach, and most importantly, an advocate for adult survivors of childhood trauma. Michael, welcome to the show, mate. How are you?

Michael: Thanks, dude. Great intro. I'm super excited to be here. I'm well, I'm excited.

Matty: I'm excited to have you here too. So people call you Michael Unbroken as your full name, what is that all about?

Michael: Yeah look, this is branding at the end of the day, if you go, my background is marketing branding almost two decades and if you go search Michael Anthony on Google, you're going to find Van Halen and I can never compete with that kind of SEO.

Matty: Totally makes sense. Obviously it's, when you talk branding, why did you choose the word unbroken? To be the sort of embodiment of your business of what you do.

Michael: Yeah. It was I got into this argument with ex girlfriend and I'd been in my journey at that point, four years, and no, probably six years. And she said something to me that I had heard before, but for whatever reason, it probably just cut deeper in the context of what was happening. And she goes, you're broken to me. And, I'd already been in this and learning and trying to go through the process and she had not yet started her journey. So there was a lot of symbiosis in our chaos between our backgrounds and what led to that moment and, I'm laying in bed that night and. It's three in the morning and like a light bulb thing. It was like, that's bullshit. That's not who I am, that's not what I believe, that's not what I think. And then just like literally think I'm broken came to me and heading into seven years now, it's been the driving force of my life and everything that we do.

Matty: Yeah, that's, yeah, I like that idea. It makes me think of Terry Cruz where he talks about, you're not broken, you're unfinished.

Michael: Yeah, that dude's interesting. His background is very similar to mine in a lot of ways. I've actually studied a bit of I've watched quite a few of his podcast recordings and seeing him and what he's been able to create knowing the background that he came from and, I don't think anybody's broken. We might be fucked up, you yeah. That so much of it has to do with your ability to assess where you're at in your life use some very critical and analytical thinking get out of your emotions right now. Obviously, there's the element of killing and that whole thing, which I'm sure we'll get into, but ultimately it's okay, cool. If you are stuck, why can you figure out causation and correlation? Can you figure out why you self sabotage bingy watch porn video games chase money have bad relationships unhealthy? There's a reason and I think that if you can get to the reason yeah, I don't think you're broken.

Matty: Can you take us through your story because I know that there's a lot that went on, including your mom chopping off your own finger, which is pretty intense. So can you just give us some context for how you came to do what you do?

Michael: Yeah, and look, and I'll say this man please do not compare stories to mine. My life is very different than many people's and. Dude, it sounds like a movie, but it's all real. I know it sounds fucking crazy, but it's all true. When I was four years old, my mother, who was a drug addict and alcoholic, she actually cut off my right index finger. So you can see multiple skin grafts, multiple surgeries, it's discolored, missing half the nail, so on and so forth. She was manic, depressive, suicidal, bipolar, narcissistic, and I don't mean in this way where we throw those fucking words around these days because we saw it on our TikTok. Certifiably hospitalized multiple times, put in mental institutions, seven or eight times rehab more times than I can count, like she was in a dark world. She married my stepdad when I was six. And that dude was massively abusive. Like the kind of guy you pray is never your stepdad. This dude's fucking six foot four, two 20 beating up a seven year old. A real man of courage and integrity, clearly I'm being sarcastic. And I spent the majority of my childhood homeless and deeply in poverty. We lived with over 30 different families from the time I was eight to 12, getting bounced around place to place. And my grandmother actually adopted me when I was 12. I'd spent six weeks by myself in an abandoned house. And somehow my grandmother found out, came to check on me. I'd been stealing food from the big lots on the corner of 30th and Georgetown in Indianapolis. I was showering at school and look, my mom just disappeared all the time. The first time I stayed home by myself, I was like five years old. So this was not new to me. And I was just like doing what I normally did. And there, there's a bit of salvation and being adopted, obviously, and having security at a different level. But dude I'm biracial black and white, and my grandma's an old racist white lady from a town in Tennessee. You never heard of, so it's like insert identity crisis and for coping, I started getting high when I was 12. Could you imagine a 12 year old getting stoned every day, all day long? By 13, I'm getting drunk, by 15, I'm getting expelled from school for selling drugs. And dude, I was just in the streets. I was breaking into houses, stealing cars, running from the cops, getting shot at hurting people. Bro, we were doing some crazy shit, I get put into a last chance program, still don't graduate high school. And in summer school, after all my friends have graduated, summer school teacher comes up to me and he's dude, it's obvious you don't want to be here. We don't even really want you here. We're going to give you the diploma. Good luck. We'll let the streets sort you out, and I was like, okay, cool. Simultaneously, I got fired from a warehouse job where I was putting microchips into motherboards 12 hours a day, like a freaking monkey, and I was sitting in my car and I'm like, all right, hold up. What the fuck is happening to your life? I was like, there's gotta be a solution in here, I'm missing. What's the solution for poverty, for homelessness, for everything I've been through? I was like, it's money, ‘cause what else would it be, and I made a declaration to myself, but by time I was 21, I would make a hundred grand a year legally, which is incredibly important. I have been in handcuffs more times than I can count my three childhood best friends have been murdered and I got family in prison for life. And so I knew what was going to happen if I didn't like change. The trajectory sure enough, I landed a job with a massive company, fortune 10 company in America. By the time I'm 25 heading into 26, I made a million bucks. But I was 350 pounds, smoking two packs a day, drinking myself to sleep, 50, 000 in debt, cheating on my girlfriend, my car got repossessed, and my little brother tells me, never talk to me again, you're not my brother, and so I hit this massive fucking rock bottom. And one morning I'm laying in bed, dude, keep in mind, I'm 350 pounds. I'm eating chocolate cake, smoking a joint and watching the CrossFit games, as this is rock bottom. It doesn't, the only way it gets worse is if I kill somebody, that's it. And for whatever reason, man, I picked myself up, I went in the bathroom, I looked at myself in the mirror and I asked myself a question. What are you willing to do to have the life that you want to have? And I don't know where this came from, but the answer was no excuses, just results. And that was 13 years ago.

Matty: What a story like that is. Yeah, it does sound like a movie or even a multiple series, mini-series of documentaries or whatever about your life, that's really intense. The thing that kept coming up for me in that story is what do you think? And maybe there is no answer to this, but what do you think is the difference between people that go through somewhat similar experiences or any degree of childhood trauma that get to a point where they decide they need to change. Is it religion? Is it God? Is it some kind of level of trauma that leads to somebody having that moment of, I need to change? Because so many people don't have that moment of, I need to change.

Michael: Yeah, I don't know. It's different for everybody. Matty, I've coached, I don't know, fucking 10, 000 people, probably, I have no idea. I've completely lost count, that podcast that I have think unbroken. We'll do 2 million downloads this year, thousands and thousands of copies of my book. I've spoken on stages in front of, 5, 7, 10, 000 people, I don't know, I literally don't know. What I do know is that every single person who lives in when they put their head on the pillow at night, they know what the fuck they need to do. And I think we're dismissive of that, I think we lie to ourselves and we say it's okay, and tomorrow, and it's not a big deal and don't worry about it. And I'll figure it out one day and blah, blah, blah. And the next thing you know, you're dead, and between that moment of like your head is on the pillow and dead, you've had ample opportunity. And it's not just you hear a lot of people say when the suffering is greater than the place that you're at, you'll make change, and I'm like, yeah, sure. Unless you've been indoctrinated and bathed in the idea that suffering is life and that you deserve all the things you've been through, which is what is true for most people who had massively traumatic childhoods, because like trauma, like trauma isn't like the cuts and the scars and the burns, like that's part of it. But to me, that's not the thing, to me, the thing is the fact that your identity has been stolen, and so imagine this you're on this journey and you're like, okay, I want to have a different life, but every single time you try to take a step forward, there's a copious amount of self sabotage, the word that we often throw around, but a word that is actually super important. But the misnomer in self sabotage is that people believe that it's a conscientious decision, I would argue that in fact, it's actually not. What it is it's this dynamic programming that's been indoctrinated and enmeshed in you since youth, since you were a baby and it's, you don't matter, you're not good enough, you don't deserve it, it's for somebody else, you suck, whatever that thing might be. And so you walk down this path in this journey and it's okay, cool. If that's the only thing that you've ever heard, why would you believe otherwise? And so you see these people and I don't even necessarily mean just social media. People in your life, your community your neighborhood, and you're like. They have a nice car and they have a healthy relationship and they're in shape and I don't see them smoking and they don't drink, and it doesn't appear like from the outside, looking in that their life is as chaotic as mine. No, it may or may not be. I don't know, that's not the point. The point is that as you're measuring this, you're stuck in this false narrative of belief that's not for me, what they have over there will never be for me, because all you ever heard is, you don't matter, you're not important, and it's not for you. And so when you're 19, 25, 37, 52 years old, if that's your mentality and your mindset, which is entirely baked into you, and if it's true that you're the sum total of all of your experiences, which I believe that it is now you're facing a paradigm shift of stepping into the unknown, i.e. Love yourself, do the thing that you need to do, show up and live your life. But you've only been shown whether it's from your community, your parents, from your teachers, from your family, that it's okay to not strive for what you want. Because. Fuck you. That's why you're not going to take the steps. And so people hear self sabotage, but they don't recognize that it's actually their modus operandi, like it's their MO. It is so ingrained in them not to do the thing, but they can't connect the dots, and so when it comes time to do the thing, they often find all the reasons in the world not to do the thing. Now, further, if you look at it from a deeper perspective. In front of you is the thing that you know, you need to do the thing that keeps you awake at night, but creating the change that is going to formulate the future of the life of the person that you want to be well, easier said than done very simply, because if you look at this let's measure honesty for a moment if you I believe that the precursor to this entire journey is to be honest, right? And to tell yourself the truth, if you're fat, don't lie about it, if you're unhealthy, don't lie about it. If you're cheating, don't lie about it. This doesn't mean that you're culpable for the bad things that happen, that's not on you. It's not your fault or your responsibility, your mom's a drug addict, your stepdad's a piece of shit, whatever it is that you come from. But in the space of honesty, what happens is you start to actually paint the picture of the reality of the truth that you're living in. Most of us are in la land, and I really mean that's just like nonchalantly going about life. And you're like, why does my livestock, it must be what it's supposed to be. Not recognizing that when you're a child, honesty is something that is going to lead down a path of suffering, pain, and ramification. To tell the truth is the most dangerous things people can do who grew up in environments like me. Where'd that bruise come from? Oh, I just, I fell down the stairs, why aren't you eating at home? Oh, my mom's super busy. She's all you, blah, blah, blah. Why are your grades, why do you have straight F's? And so you learn to lie because you tell the truth and there's an immense amount of suffering that comes with that, dude, if I told the truth in my house, my stepdad would throw me through a fucking wall. And I mean that in a literal way, and so how do you tell the truth as an adult to go and live the life that you want to live, knowing that this reaction to having interaction with other people has become really a survival mechanism. You're lying all the time to everyone, just so you have safety, and if the brain's primary function is to create safety, then the idea of stepping into the unknown and being the person that you want to be is catalyzed by this concept that you can't because you're only lying to yourself. And so when you stop lying to yourself and look, and you got to be realistic through this healing journey, it's fucking hard. It's going to take a long time. It's going to cost a lot of money. That's the truth of it. But it begins with the willingness to sit in it, to look at it biasly and go, I'm a liar and I don't come through. I don't follow through my life because I've been told that is the way that I'm supposed to operate, which has led to become a survival mechanism when I'm under the stress and the pressure of stepping into the unknown and becoming a new version of you is unknown. You've never done it before. There's nothing more terrifying to the brain than that.

Matty: It's interesting too that you talk about that honesty concept and it makes a lot of sense, and we're in this era, this personal development era, which has been ushered in by social media and people's access to personal development information. We're in this world where it's, it's just treat yourself. No, you're totally fine, we're all a bit stressed and we're in this world. Yeah, exactly. But we're living in this constant illusion of our social circle and the people around us that are like, Oh no, it's okay. Just have another chocolate, just have a glass of wine to relax or, even non food related stuff. People just Oh shit happens, this is how it goes. And it's like that honesty is continued on as adults because everybody's just trying. Incorrectly, but trying to make everybody feel better because nobody wants anyone to suffer or feel like they're not the, the version of themselves that they should be when in actual fact, obviously, we need people like yourself to call people out and tell them that their truth so they can confront it. And obviously they need to then say it to themselves.

Michael: And look, it's really about what you just said, their truth, you want the chocolate, eat the chocolate, you want the wine, drink the wine, but don't blame the world for your fucking problems and act like a victim, and that's the hard part. That's the thing that I say that I get canceled for that people email me and they go, how dare you try to coach people telling people to not be a victim. Look, you have all the right in the world to be the victim. I'm not taking it away from you. But how does it serve you? How the fuck has being the victim helped your life be better? One of the things growing up that was a real strong moniker of success was I would see people in my neighborhood Celebrate being on welfare and government assistance. Hey a great news, man. I just found out my job cut me back four hours a week I get welfare now, and I'm like that's your model for success.

Matty: I grew up in a town that had similar types of people and when I was a teenager, they had the thing here called the baby bonus. So if you had a baby, the government gave you like five grand and so people would just start popping out babies and that would be like just to collect the welfare dollars.

Michael: Yeah, what does that tell you about a society of people who's being ruled and governed by ignorance, right? And so now you're faced with okay, my life sucks, but I'm on welfare. So I guess it doesn't suck that bad and everybody around me is on welfare. So I guess I'm supposed to live this life, but then when anything happens, I blame the government I blame my friends, I blame my community. You're the victim and look, there's dude, I teach my clients this every single day. Life is going to life. It's hard, it's fucking dirty, it's mucky. It is not always great. Dude, there's days where I'm like, oh, dude, I just spoke on five stages and we sold this many books and we had this many people come in the coaching and then I'm like having a fucking massive panic attack. Right or I'm anxious or I don't feel good or somebody died or this project fell through or like that is life, man. And so it's really about learning how to control your emotions in light of the thing that's in front of you and continue to progress forward towards what it is that you want. And if you want to be the victim, fine, I've been it and I'm not here to cast judgment or to accuse anyone of anything, bro. You don't get to 350 pounds smoking two packs a day, cheating on your girlfriend, 50, 000 in debt, getting your car repoed and your brother telling you never talk to you again because your life isn't right. And so it's I know what it's like, but I also know what it's like to be on the other side and last thing, got to be a coach or speaker, any of that bullshit, like whatever, do whatever it is that you want to do, but recognize the role that you're playing in your own suffering, and most people don't want to do that because when you turn the fingers towards yourself, it is a reflection of the choices, actions, decisions that you've made. And we have this need for whatever fucking reason, man. I wish I could find the solution to this. We have this need as humans to suffer, it's like we love it, we fucking love to be in pain, and so we eat the food that makes us sick. We date the person that makes us miserable, we have the job that's unfulfilling and unsatisfactory. We have friendship groups that don't support us and pull our dreams down. We put ourselves in these positions, constantly to have less than what we are capable of having, and then we look at the world and we go, why do they get a habit? And I don't, and it's because you're not making actions and choices that lead you down the path to have the thing that you want. And you always hear the like money is not going to save you, it's a great asset, you fucking need money. Go get rich, if you can, it makes life a lot easier, but it's not going to bring you joy. It's not going to make you love yourself, it's not going to do anything for you other than be a resource. And so people are measuring like money as happiness, which I did too. That's how I got super successful, very young. But the reality is if you want to build self confidence, there's three things that I teach my clients. It's actually on my wall right here, ‘cause I read it every single day as we're in coaching and I'm on podcasts, stuff like that, there's three things that you got to understand. If you want to get out of victim hood and really become this hero of your own story, whatever it means for you, dude, I don't know what it is for you. It's different for all of us, you got to show up. That's number one, show up for your fucking life, man. Get off the video games, get off the porn, get off the fast food, just show, just start somewhere. Take an action today, be honest with yourself. That's number two. We talked about this briefly, but really it's like an incredible precursor to all this success, and then number three is execute. Most people, dude, it is fascinating to me. How many people will sit down and create all of the things that they want to do on paper. They'll think about it, they'll write it down, they'll talk to their friends, and then they do nothing. When you start doing something, you close the gap of who you are to who you want to become. In that process of suffering, which actually means to be in discomfort, through that process of suffering, you grow. And in that growth, you build self confidence, and in that self confidence, you close the gap to become the person you're capable of being, and so you can play the victim, or you can walk the fucking path of life and play the game and ultimately have what you want.

Matty: It's funny that you mentioned that people write stuff down and then do nothing. And you've probably had this experience too. I know that All of the colleagues in the space that I work in have, but I've had people that have purchased programs and gone through the whole sales process of signing up and then never attend a single call, I email them, I ring them, I do all of the things to do, my part of the deal, trying to, help them as much as I can, but they've just done enough with their belief systems by purchasing the program, and then they never show up.

Michael: And then, what happens, Matty, you know what they do? They go, I tried Matty's program, it didn't work. And so for those people, it's cool, good luck with the rest of your life, but don't complain because nobody wants to hear it because you didn't try.

Matty: Yeah, absolutely.

Michael: I've no empathy for that. And this is the hard thing, man. I don't have any empathy for that because it's like on one hand, you've done everything leading up to the most important part. You didn't see it through, you did not cross the fucking finish line. And yet, because you didn't get the gold medal, you want to have people cry for you. And it's what do you get out of that? How has that helped your life? How has that made you better? How has that made you healthier? How has that fixed your relationships? Fixed your money, fixed your health, fix your wealth, fix your legacy. It hasn't, and yet at the end of the day, you're going to be like I tried. And that Matty guy, he's great, but he wasn't for me, I'm like. No, you're not for you because you're not willing to show up and that makes you a fucking coward. And that is hard because when you say that to people, it's a, it feels like a smack in the face, but we have to be better at being honest with people. Stop lying to each other, stop being like, Oh, you gave it a good try. Maybe you'll find, no, you didn't actually try. You didn't do the thing, dude. It is incredibly, when I watch the clients that come into both my weekly coaching programs and my one on one programs, I always tell them you're committed for a year, like you're in like, I'm going to take your money every single month and whether you're there or not, I'm doing that. And I'm not refunding you because my commitment to you is that I'm going to do everything in my power for you to win. Your commitment to me is that you're going to do everything in your power for you to win. And people are like, yeah, I got this coach and he didn't help me. And I'm like no, the job of being a coach is to win the player, the job of the player is to win the game.

Matty: I like that framing.

Michael: You don't see Bill Belichick in the game during the Super Bowl, and so we're on the sidelines, here's the game. Matty, here's the game plan. But you're 74 pounds overweight, okay, awesome, I've been there. I know that world, what's amazing is you're actually way more committed than you believe. Look at the effort. It took you to get to 74 pounds overweight. You're really good at this. Now imagine what happens if we turn you in the right direction and you commit to that. We already know you commit. But you're committed the wrong way. So let's get you committed in the right direction. Let's get you showing up for your life in the way that you need to. Let's see what happens when you turn 74 pounds into intention and action. But if you're not willing to do that, bro, I can't help you. And that's the hardest part about being a coach is we can't want it for them. And the truth be told, I do, I desperately do. And it's so disconcerting to sit here and to watch the people who have success in my programs fucking hit the moon, the people who show up every single week, who are honest and who are executing those three rules, the people who do that, dude, I can measure it like clockwork within six months, their lives are completely different. The people who show up every now and then who play half assed, you only get into the game. Their life is the exact same in six months. You gotta play all out. And when I say the word coward, it's really, if you look at the, it's to be in fear, you're scared, you should be, you've never done this before. But the reality is like, Azure in this journey, doing something you've never done before, if you have somebody like a, you or me, Matty, and we are just simply a step ahead of them, we're the ones leading them down the tunnel with the flashlight, and it's man, if you'll just take my fucking hand, I'm right in front of you. All you got to do is reach out and that is the thing that people have to cross the chasm of the ego has this unstationable need to be right, but the being right is again tied into that self sabotaging behavior and it's exponential in this way in which you've done it so many times now that need to be right as I knew Matty's program wasn't going to work.

Matty: I'm curious with the way that you just described that we're just a step ahead of them where, we've got the flashlight, we've just got to take them with us and talking before about the fact that, people are scared of stepping into the unknown, they've never done this before. What do you think is the most important variable for having the courage to step into the unknown?

Is it community? Is it just relenting willpower? Because I know, and you probably know if we're relying just on willpower, that eventually burns out real quick.

Michael: Yeah, willpower won't get it done. Willpower, willpower certainly helps. Ultimately, I think it's discipline over everything that really gets it done, ‘cause you know this, man. You help people in this space and it's alright, cool. When I was 350, I had no discipline. When I'm 205 with a six pack, there's discipline. That's the difference. But in the beginning, the catalyst is like looking at it and look, all so let's talk about mindset for a second, right? So mindset is the structure of the way that we operate in the world based on the variables presented to us to help us determine whether or not we can move towards something, and mindset is a word that's thrown around, especially in this industry so often that people don't actually know what it means, and there's like mindset. And I'm like no, let's talk about it. So mindset is what you think becomes what you speak become your actions become your reality. Okay, cool, so if that's true, you first have to decide in your mind that you can, because think about this for a second, dude, people are so mean to themselves. They're like, I'm a loser, I suck, I ate the brownie. I'm a piece of shit, I had a Coca Cola. I might as well kill myself, people really say this shit. How do I know? Because I fucking did it, the words I used to use are insane. Dude, it's crazy how I used to talk to myself and right now there are people listening who like, they're being so mean to themselves. It's bro, if you said that to me, I would punch you in the fucking face and it's but you're expecting to be successful, there's a disconnect there, there's a disconnect, and so how do you step into success? If you're an asshole to yourself, you can will it, but eventually you're going to burn down everything around you in the process. Ask me what million dollars looks like when you're 26, but you lost it all, willpower in the wrong direction, and then you look at it and you go, okay, wait a second, what if I led myself with kindness and kindness is about showing up, right? That's that number one rule. I need, I must, I will eat right. Go to the gym, get out of the relationship, quit the job, rewrite the CV go travel the world, write the book, start the pot, like you have to literally, so willpower is an interesting word in this equation, but it's not the word that I think becomes what creates the change, it's force because force ultimately a hard enough push will create momentum because if you force it, like you're like, man, I don't want to go to the gym today. You fucking go anyway, I don't want to go to coaching today, I don't feel good, go anyway. Do you know Tom Bilyeu? Go us, okay. So Tom and I have spent a lot of time together over the years and Tom was teaching a business mastery course that cost a tremendous amount of money to get into. And he's only done it, I believe twice and he never did it again, I learned more out of that course than I learned through anything I've probably ever done in business. Here's the craziest thing that I'm going to say about the idea about force. Morning of day one of that course, I had hernia surgery in the afternoon was day one of that course live. I'm sitting here on pain meds in my living room, iced up in the course, forcing it. I didn't have to get in my car and go anywhere, I didn't have to hop on a plane, I just had to be in the online room. And it's like, how bad do you really want this? Yeah, because there's going to be moments where life is going to life and you're going to have to make a decision. Kobe Bryant playing with a torn Achilles, playing with a broken hand shooting left handed, right? Guys like that do that. This is all mindset, dude It's just a game, that's all life is and if you can control your emotions you win the game because your emotions are always gonna tell you not to do it, but that force It becomes a non negotiable when I look at, I only rarely share this, ‘cause it's a weird thing to talk about. I'm a huge fan of 1980s action movies like under siege on deadly ground, like you fucking name it. These really awful eighties commando Cobra, like I could go on, right? A lot of them are themed around terrorism. That's the time in the world that we lived in, and especially in America. And you would always hear in these movies, these guys go, I don't negotiate with terrorists, you hear that all the time or the government, we don't negotiate or whatever, and one of the things, and this is something I don't really use often anymore, but in the beginning I used a lot, I would call myself a terrorist. I would look in the mirror and I'm like, I don't negotiate with terrorists. Go to the gym. Right now, don't go to McDonald's, eat the salad, throw the alcohol away, throw the cigarettes away, do the fucking thing that you said you're going to do. And I think so much of it is like hardening your mind a little bit. We, and it's difficult because on this one hand you're like, but what does that have to do with kindness? And it's because isn't the kindest thing that you could do is the thing that you said you were going to do.

Matty: Yeah. Honoring yourself. What's your thoughts about the idea that tension seeks release in the sense that if we force all of these unnatural, uncomfortable things, and there's so much pressure that at some point we're going to explode, we're going to binge on the thing, we're going to abandon the gym. Like, how do we process that, that former personality or that previous version of ourself that is still adding force in the opposite direction.

Michael: Why are you doing this? Because if you're only doing it for you, you're gonna win. If you're doing it for the strangers on the internet, if you're doing it from accolades from your parents, which you're probably never going to get, if you're doing it for your partner, you're gonna lose. And you're going to explode and you're going to do things that you don't want to do in the hopes that you'll be seen by other people. And I can tell you right now, and this man, nobody fills your cup up. Nobody on planet earth fills your cup up, but you, and so if you have clarity about who it is that you want to become. Do the things that you need to do, not that they want you to do the things that you need to do. The thing that inevitably happens is you'll recognize that you're actually only doing the things that you want, and if you're only doing the things that you want, why would you explode? I, it's like it's like a simple equation. If I do what I want, I'm living life on my terms and I win, if I do what other people want me to do in the hopes of love, admiration compassion, wealth, worth, then I'm always going to be miserable and ultimately I will explode. Yeah. It doesn't seem that complicated to me.

Matty: No, it's not when we break it all down. And I think that the excuses and the narratives and the stories that we have inherited or taken along our life journey, it just becomes so embedded, and as we said at the start, the norm that's the reality that we've shaped for ourselves.

Michael: Yeah. And think about that. Whose reality is it truly? Whose life are you truly living? Are you living your parents life, your community's life, your friend's life, your partner's life? Whose life are you living? Because you're scared of conflict. Because you're scared of saying no, because you're scared of the idea that when you get fucking tattooed and you have a nose ring and you say fuck all the time that people are going to judge you, like, where do you live in this ether of reality? Because, all right, if you look at the matrix, which is my favorite movie of all time and a highly quoted movie.

Matty: Same actually.

Michael: And look, it's a highly quoted movie in our world. I would say Tron legacy is a close second for me, very similar themes, right? They're the hero's journey, really all the best movies are. And if you go look at it and you pay very close attention, the thing that's happening is Neo is effectively becoming the person that he's meant to be through training, the reinforcement and through force in the final scene of the movie. During the train, when Neo gets killed, it is pure force that brings him back to life to go and fight Mr. Smith to ultimately win and in the film. It's forced. It's not man. I really wish I could. It's I'm going to do it, but he was doing it on his terms within the rules and the confines of the matrix, there are certain things that can be bent and that's what I think about in terms of life. It's like I am bending the world to me. I am not bending me to the world, you don't like me. I don't care, I genuinely don't. Matty, if you get off this with me fuck that guy, he sucks, I could give a fuck less.

Matty: I think you're awesome, bro.

Michael: But no, I appreciate that, but I also don't care. And that's not to be dismissive, because it goes both ways. It's because I fill myself up. I love myself. I do the work. When I look in that mirror, I'm good. I can't let other opinions, people's opinion affect me negatively or positively. Not that I don't feel them because they're real and emotions happen, but it's like I'm taking measurement of point. How do I feel about me? Because I'm bending the world around who I am and who I want to be, not who you want me to be or expect me to be, and I think that when you can get to that place, there's actually a lot of freedom in it, I remember I was in this study hall class, freshman year of high school, and there's a hilarious story. There's this girl I have a crush on and I'm like 14 or whatever. And you can't talk in study hall, right? It's a study hall, and I rarely ever went to school. But this one day I bit up the courage, Matty. I was like, I'm going to talk to this girl today, and it was like terrifying, how does the first time you talk to a girl, you're like, I'm going to shit my pants. And then you're like, wait, she probably is whatever. And I'm sitting next to her and all morning I've been thinking like, what is the question I could ask her? What is the I'm going to ask her this question, it's going to turn into a romcom and we'll be married and the whole cause you're a child and you're dumb and you don't know anything about fucking anything. And I was like, ah, I know the question. So we're sitting next to each other in this class, and I look at her, I go, Hey, if you could have any superpower, what would it be? Bro, that question is incredible, that is probably the greatest question ever constructed, and she looked, I swear on my life, on everything. I love this. What girl looks at me and she goes, do you always ask people whatever you're thinking crushed? And in that moment, I stopped giving a fuck what people think about me. And that's a superpower, and if you can get to that place in your life, away from the judgment, the shame, the ridicule of all the people, dude, I can't remember that girl's name. I can't remember what she looks like, she could be a homeless meth addict or she could be a billionaire. I have no idea because I don't remember, but imagine there are people who carry that with them for life. It's yeah, what purpose? How does that serve you? And so that thing where you start shaping the world around you is within the context of your mission, your vision, your values, your boundaries, who it is that you want to become and not breaking that for anybody.

Matty: I think that's fantastic, man. I think you're awesome. I think we definitely need to have a bunch more conversations because I think we could talk for ages, but for everybody that's really into what you're saying and connecting with you, where can they find you online?

Michael: Yeah, dude, I'm everywhere at Michael Unbroken, all the socials. And then, of course, the Think Unbroken Podcast. And that's Think Unbroken Podcast, Apple podcast, iTunes, blah, blah, blah. You know where you listen to podcasts.

Matty: Yeah, fantastic. And for anybody listening, if you've enjoyed this episode, feel free to take a screenshot or share this episode with a friend or family member that you think needs to hear this stuff because these conversations can be difficult. So just use this podcast to bring that conversation up. And all the links, all Michael's links will be down in the show notes below. So head down there, click the link, and to finish us off today, Michael, what is one piece of health information that you wish more people knew about?

Michael: Yeah, it's funny because we didn't talk about my physical health journey, right from 350 pounds to 200 and what that process and what that journey has been like and the food changes and all that. So I'd love to pop back and do it again, but this is one of the scope of mental health, let's stay there. And I would say the 1 thing that I wish I would have learned, or people would have told me about or that I could have wrapped my head around younger is just simply that confidence is built through doing hard shit. That's it, man. I like that. If you want to, if you want to really love yourself, if you want to transform, if you want to be this person that you want to be like, you're only going to become that person by doing hard shit constantly, every day, especially when you don't want to.

Matty: I think that's a fantastic way to end and I completely agree. So thank you so much for being here, man. I've really appreciate your time. You're sharing your journey and your story and your inspiration. And yeah, let's tee it up again. Let's do another couple of conversations. Yeah, no doubt, man.

Michael: It's an honor. Thank you, brother.

Matty: Thank you.